(Archived) THE RUMOUR MILL - Player Movement

[Wiz]

Any signing of Klem should come with the requirement he shave his head, which will instantly make him play more aggressively. But yes he'd be coming as more of a workhorse than an out and out Enforcer.
I'd probably rather have a bunch of guys who play aggressive than one absolute liability though and I think Klem can contribute to that.

You're more signing him for his tremendous workload
Per Fox Stats averages (rankings are all players unless otherwise noted) Klem makes
50th most tackles in NRL (14th for props) with 18th best efficiency overall
Coupled with 16th highest run meters (3rd for props)

Defensively we have Toby (54th), Dale (68), BHU (244) and Hunt (262) who are ranked 122, 139, 168 and 173 efficiency collectively.
Kaufusi is 179 and 36 (good efficiency!)

For average meters we have Toby (135th), Dale (192), Hunt (226) and BHU (245) with Kaufusi (212) incoming.

Klem averages 61 mins a game with Rudolf 51, Dale 48, BHU 33, Hunt 29 & Kaufusi 35.
We have quite a few guys Fitz seems to like using for fairly restricted minutes when he can.

So he joins Toby and Dale as a good tackler but with standout efficiency (which Fitz would love) meanwhile he makes a tonne more meters than any of our current guys, beating Toby 146 to 101. He close to doubles the rest.

I'm not all in on Klem or anything I'm just joining the recurring convo.
I'd be surprised if it happened, but I think it'd be good.
I think our position is strong enough we won't feel pressured to overpay anyone.

Wow… our forwards are rubbish

 

[Rob]

BHU has some great games, his biggest improvement would probably be consistency TBH, and I think that is something he can work towards

Was our worst player in the semis by a fair way.
Has good moments but was my biggest disappointment in the back end of the year. Let’s hope it was due to injury and can improve his game to where it needs to be, if not can see him struggling to get in the best 17 next year.

 

[stormshark]

Yes the Sharkies strength of Decades, even in the trying times, is alas no more. Need 2 GOOD forwards more imho. Keeping The Nut and Colqohoun, then a Very good extra Prop is the Minimum imho for next yr..

 

[HaroldBishop]

Yes the Sharkies strength of Decades, even in the trying times, is alas no more. Need 2 GOOD forwards more imho. Keeping The Nut and Colqohoun, then a Very good extra Prop is the Minimum imho for next yr..

I still don't see it in the nut mate. What are you basing this on?

 

[BurgoShark]

Any signing of Klem should come with the requirement he shave his head, which will instantly make him play more aggressively. But yes he'd be coming as more of a workhorse than an out and out Enforcer.
I'd probably rather have a bunch of guys who play aggressive than one absolute liability though and I think Klem can contribute to that.

You're more signing him for his tremendous workload
Per Fox Stats averages (rankings are all players unless otherwise noted) Klem makes
50th most tackles in NRL (14th for props) with 18th best efficiency overall
Coupled with 16th highest run meters (3rd for props)

Defensively we have Toby (54th), Dale (68), BHU (244) and Hunt (262) who are ranked 122, 139, 168 and 173 efficiency collectively.
Kaufusi is 179 and 36 (good efficiency!)

For average meters we have Toby (135th), Dale (192), Hunt (226) and BHU (245) with Kaufusi (212) incoming.

Klem averages 61 mins a game with Rudolf 51, Dale 48, BHU 33, Hunt 29 & Kaufusi 35.
We have quite a few guys Fitz seems to like using for fairly restricted minutes when he can.

So he joins Toby and Dale as a good tackler but with standout efficiency (which Fitz would love) meanwhile he makes a tonne more meters than any of our current guys, beating Toby 146 to 101. He close to doubles the rest.

I'm not all in on Klem or anything I'm just joining the recurring convo.
I'd be surprised if it happened, but I think it'd be good.
I think our position is strong enough we won't feel pressured to overpay anyone.

Amazing that the guy who plays more minutes has higher “per game” averages than everyone else. I wonder how that could be…

If you can only choose one stat to compare middles, it’s minutes. The coaches know all the other stats, and put out the best players for longer

… and that’s minutes in games they finished healthy. A 6 minute cameo for Dale before having his head taken off doesn’t count.

BHU also had a major injury and played low minutes in his first few games back. That messes with the averages. Round 1-5 he was averaging over 40 minutes. Same in the final 5 rounds.

 

[stormshark]

I still don't see it in the nut mate. What are you basing this on?

Yes admittedly not a lot, couple of Flegg games and that couple of Pre Season games, and the debut.. I just think he hasn't been given a good go yet in 1sts to really see what he can do. If Gav Miller also endorses, that's a good sign also.

 

[Gumby]

He'd be an easy sell being so tight with Toby

I spoke to Toby about this a month or so ago. He’s deadset trying to get him here.

 

[bort]

Amazing that the guy who plays more minutes has higher “per game” averages than everyone else. I wonder how that could be…

If you can only choose one stat to compare middles, it’s minutes. The coaches know all the other stats, and put out the best players for longer

… and that’s minutes in games they finished healthy. A 6 minute cameo for Dale before having his head taken off doesn’t count.

BHU also had a major injury and played low minutes in his first few games back. That messes with the averages. Round 1-5 he was averaging over 40 minutes. Same in the final 5 rounds.

And yet the minutes and runs and tackles are still valuable

Not gunna hold it against Klemmer he gets through more work and bigger minutes than others because he can and they, seemingly, can’t.

Graph it all out if you want a more in-depth breakdown and you can show any Klemmers 150ish in 60 mins isn’t as good as Rudolfs 100 in 50 because Dale got injured one week

 

[Gal The Goat]

For what it’s worth with this Klemmer discussion he rated pretty highly on key stats

I know stats don’t tell the full story but it tells part of it, and none of our props feature in them

 

[BurgoShark]

Yes admittedly not a lot, couple of Flegg games and that couple of Pre Season games, and the debut.. I just think he hasn't been given a good go yet in 1sts to really see what he can do. If Gav Miller also endorses, that's a good sign also.

The guy just keeps improving. I’m not counting him out.

He went from Flegg depth player to PoTY, Glebe to first forward picked for the Jets, and 6-week training contract to NRL top 30.

He did all of that while not being a full-time footballer, and he plays a position for which there is a track record of guys peaking after 25.

He’s 3 years younger than Toby, and the start of next season will be 3 years since Toby’s debut. Tommy may not end up as an NRL regular, but he’s proven a lot of people wrong so far. I’m not joining the list.

 

[BurgoShark]

And yet the minutes and runs and tackles are still valuable

Not gunna hold it against Klemmer he gets through more work and bigger minutes than others because he can and they, seemingly, can’t.

Graph it all out if you want a more in-depth breakdown and you can show any Klemmers 150ish in 60 mins isn’t as good as Rudolfs 100 in 50 because Dale got injured one week

All I’m saying is that “metres per game” is a piss poor way to compare players. Are we saying McInnes sucks at getting metres because his 3 games in the second row dragged his average under 100m/game?

Why does Klemmer make more metres? He’s on the field more. Why is he on the field more? Probably because he is better than the other blokes in his own team.

If you want to compare Klemmer’s “metres per game” to someone, find a prop who plays similar minutes, never ever plays other positions, and didn’t leave the field prematurely at all this season (though Klemmer got binned once I think). That’s the only scenario where that stat is useful. Toby is the only one to compare on the Sharks, and yeah, Klemmer is way better than him (which we already knew).

The more impressive thing for me in those stats you listed is that he can be on the field for 60+ minutes, make all those metres, yet miss bugger all tackles. Sign him up and send Toby back to the bench!

 

[Gards]

Scheduling definitely ****ed the Jets over badly

Scheduling is a liablity - we should trade for Klemmer

my view

release - Jayden Berrell, Wade Graham, Mawene Hiroti, Royce Hunt, Matt Ikuvalu, William Kennedy, Braydon Trindall,
on the fence - Lachlan Miller,
re-sign - Sione Katoa, Jesse Ramien (only if he isnt asking for stupid money) , Siosifa Talakai, Teig Wilton

that's alot of starters and depth to cull with a few months till pre-season and not long to find replacements for them all. Do you plan to have a team to take the field? Some of them still have contracts with us into 2023 so you can't just release them unless they are willing to go and have found another home.

I think you might mean 'not extend' but it's already too late for that it seems with Wade for instance

Hunt, Miller & Ikuvalu are keeps, the rest I am not fussed on though we should persist with Kennedy as first choice FB for the time being and hope he sorts out his defense, cause if he does we will then have one heck of a fb on our hands

The re-signings you mention are a no brainer

I'd want to keep Royce Hunt unless his management wanted overs.

Agree, he was a shining light this season and tbh like with BHU have always been a fan of them at our club

The guy just keeps improving. I’m not counting him out.

He went from Flegg depth player to PoTY, Glebe to first forward picked for the Jets, and 6-week training contract to NRL top 30.

He did all of that while not being a full-time footballer, and he plays a position for which there is a track record of guys peaking after 25.

He’s 3 years younger than Toby, and the start of next season will be 3 years since Toby’s debut. Tommy may not end up as an NRL regular, but he’s proven a lot of people wrong so far. I’m not joining the list.

What I have seen of Tommy I have liked. Seems no nonsense, goes forward and tackles. Still quite young for a middle

Could become a Douglas/Galloway type player - not everyone needs to be an 'impact' forward, an enforcer or flashy. Doesn't mean the things they do in their role are not valuable. No Tolman anymore either.

I think he can make it and the Sharks are backing him to

 

[kotwben]

Geez I'd love Jackson Hastings at Cronulla.

 

[bort]

All I’m saying is that “metres per game” is a piss poor way to compare players. Are we saying McInnes sucks at getting metres because his 3 games in the second row dragged his average under 100m/game?

Why does Klemmer make more metres? He’s on the field more. Why is he on the field more? Probably because he is better than the other blokes in his own team.

If you want to compare Klemmer’s “metres per game” to someone, find a prop who plays similar minutes, never ever plays other positions, and didn’t leave the field prematurely at all this season (though Klemmer got binned once I think). That’s the only scenario where that stat is useful. Toby is the only one to compare on the Sharks, and yeah, Klemmer is way better than him (which we already knew).

The more impressive thing for me in those stats you listed is that he can be on the field for 60+ minutes, make all those metres, yet miss bugger all tackles. Sign him up and send Toby back to the bench!

That’s exactly why I posted it.

I included our guys for a little loose context.

We don’t need to specify stats don’t tell the whole story every time one gets posted do we

 

[Thresher]

Geez I'd love Jackson Hastings at Cronulla.

my only concern would be the cloud that seems to follow him wherever he goes

could all be just smoke and mirrors though

 

[Sharkfox]

We also got destroyed in the halves - Moylan is rubbish we need to look elsewhere

Hastings 7, Hynes at 6 2024

Hynes Dally M 6

Or vice versa

 

[Sharkfox]

All this klemmer talk, you'd want to get the Bulldogs klemmer and not the knights klemmer coming over and continuing that form, Saifiti brothers do more damage for knights. Forget paying big bucks for klem, don't want another woodsy looking good on stats

Chase a genuine half, even if it's not the cream of the crop, need to take the weight off Hynes shoulders so he can excel more.

We have a decent forward pack, they just need to step up and pull their heads out and fingers crossed stay injury free

 

[Sharkfox]

This guy has more heart than brooks, especially in the big games. We won it 2016 with Chad, that was including his hiccups in the semis.

 

[Sparkles]

All this klemmer talk, you'd want to get the Bulldogs klemmer and not the knights klemmer coming over and continuing that form, Saifiti brothers do more damage for knights. Forget paying big bucks for klem, don't want another woodsy looking good on stats

Chase a genuine half, even if it's not the cream of the crop, need to take the weight off Hynes shoulders so he can excel more.

We have a decent forward pack, they just need to step up and pull their heads out and fingers crossed stay injury free

I reckon it'd take one wrestling session with Fitz and the old Klemmer would reemerge.

 

[BurgoShark]

Geez I'd love Jackson Hastings at Cronulla.

It’s a yes from me