Official Braden Hamlin-Uele

andrew's_sharks

Great White
Joined
Sep 10, 2010
Messages
4,204
Reaction score
602
Location
Melbourne
Before that Hunt had a serious knee injury. So nut sure the would mean BHU gets a start over him. Hunt was turning into an excellent impact prop late in the year. I think they are both crucial if we are to be successful this year. But I still think Hunt will start.
 

andrew's_sharks

Great White
Joined
Sep 10, 2010
Messages
4,204
Reaction score
602
Location
Melbourne
Kaufusi to start and be the form prop of the comp.
Hopefully! I have seen some comments saying he is not that good, but the truth is at the same age he is better than any of our current props were. I also think a lot of people fail to see how good he is at getting back into the line and in the right defensive positions. No doubt Fitz has seen this.
 

BurgoShark

Super Moderator
Joined
Apr 8, 2008
Messages
12,794
Reaction score
4,018
Before that Hunt had a serious knee injury. So nut sure the would mean BHU gets a start over him. Hunt was turning into an excellent impact prop late in the year. I think they are both crucial if we are to be successful this year. But I still think Hunt will start.
Obviously the injury is a factor. Here's how the season went though...

- Rounds 1-6 Williams and BHU were picked ahead of Hunt and both played more minutes than him.
- Finucane and BHU were both injured in round 6.
- Round 7 both Tolman and Williams played more minutes than Hunt
- Round 8 Williams got hurt, and Tolman played more minutes than Hunt
- Round 9 Finucane returned. Hunt didn't play
- Round 10 Williams returned, but got injured again. Hunt played from the bench and got similar minutes to Tolman. Fifita didn't play.
- Rounds 11- 14 with the team missing all 3 of BHU, Williams and Finucane, Hunt became the starting prop, playing a little more than Fifita but always less than Tolman.
- Round 15-17 Finucane retuned. Hunt's minutes stayed consistent
- Round 18-19 BHU returned (from the bench). Hunt's minutes stayed consistent
- Round 20 Hunt started but got injured early and missed the following week
- Round 22 he returned and started. Played less minutes than everyone except Colquhoun
- Rounds 23-25 Toby was out. Hunt started and played his highest minutes ever
- Finals #1 he started and played his usual minutes (less than 30), but got another short stint when the game went to extra time
- He missed finals #2 injured.

What all of this tells me is that as the season went on, Hunt played his way ahead of Tolman and Fifita - but not anyone else. He wasn't a regular in the team until 3 middle forwards all got injured, and the only time his minutes went up was when Rudolf was out injured. In those same games BHU still played more than him.

Fitz wants to play a certain way, which dictates that a genuine prop is on the field for the opening 20. There were times in 2022 when Royce Hunt was the best choice to play that opening 20, but on average he played less than 6-7 minutes/game after the 20-minute mark. When everyone is healthy, he may still end up being the guy who wears the #10, but a healthy BHU is playing more minutes than him every time.
 

bort

Jaws
Joined
Jun 4, 2007
Messages
29,908
Reaction score
5,821
Location
IN A BAR
What he said ⬇️

... and Finucane injury/suspension.
(and now all of the above)
I know how he ended up starting, just saying I don't think he specifically plays 'low minutes wrapped around halftime'.
Even if that is where he is "best" he's quite clearly capable of starting. His lower total time on field doesn't change the fact a lot of it was as a starter.

Hunt even just started a World Cup final over Papali'i (and Leniu & Taupau but you'd probably expect those ones).

He's a low minute prop, I just don't think he is a prop who can only play around halftime.
 

andrew's_sharks

Great White
Joined
Sep 10, 2010
Messages
4,204
Reaction score
602
Location
Melbourne
Obviously the injury is a factor. Here's how the season went though...

- Rounds 1-6 Williams and BHU were picked ahead of Hunt and both played more minutes than him.
- Finucane and BHU were both injured in round 6.
- Round 7 both Tolman and Williams played more minutes than Hunt
- Round 8 Williams got hurt, and Tolman played more minutes than Hunt
- Round 9 Finucane returned. Hunt didn't play
- Round 10 Williams returned, but got injured again. Hunt played from the bench and got similar minutes to Tolman. Fifita didn't play.
- Rounds 11- 14 with the team missing all 3 of BHU, Williams and Finucane, Hunt became the starting prop, playing a little more than Fifita but always less than Tolman.
- Round 15-17 Finucane retuned. Hunt's minutes stayed consistent
- Round 18-19 BHU returned (from the bench). Hunt's minutes stayed consistent
- Round 20 Hunt started but got injured early and missed the following week
- Round 22 he returned and started. Played less minutes than everyone except Colquhoun
- Rounds 23-25 Toby was out. Hunt started and played his highest minutes ever
- Finals #1 he started and played his usual minutes (less than 30), but got another short stint when the game went to extra time
- He missed finals #2 injured.

What all of this tells me is that as the season went on, Hunt played his way ahead of Tolman and Fifita - but not anyone else. He wasn't a regular in the team until 3 middle forwards all got injured, and the only time his minutes went up was when Rudolf was out injured. In those same games BHU still played more than him.

Fitz wants to play a certain way, which dictates that a genuine prop is on the field for the opening 20. There were times in 2022 when Royce Hunt was the best choice to play that opening 20, but on average he played less than 6-7 minutes/game after the 20-minute mark. When everyone is healthy, he may still end up being the guy who wears the #10, but a healthy BHU is playing more minutes than him every time.
I don't doubt the playing more than him comment. Just saying I think Hunt will start and BHU will play either side of half time.
 

Sparkles

Jaws
Joined
May 21, 2008
Messages
11,996
Reaction score
2,725
Obviously the injury is a factor. Here's how the season went though...

- Rounds 1-6 Williams and BHU were picked ahead of Hunt and both played more minutes than him.
- Finucane and BHU were both injured in round 6.
- Round 7 both Tolman and Williams played more minutes than Hunt
- Round 8 Williams got hurt, and Tolman played more minutes than Hunt
- Round 9 Finucane returned. Hunt didn't play
- Round 10 Williams returned, but got injured again. Hunt played from the bench and got similar minutes to Tolman. Fifita didn't play.
- Rounds 11- 14 with the team missing all 3 of BHU, Williams and Finucane, Hunt became the starting prop, playing a little more than Fifita but always less than Tolman.
- Round 15-17 Finucane retuned. Hunt's minutes stayed consistent
- Round 18-19 BHU returned (from the bench). Hunt's minutes stayed consistent
- Round 20 Hunt started but got injured early and missed the following week
- Round 22 he returned and started. Played less minutes than everyone except Colquhoun
- Rounds 23-25 Toby was out. Hunt started and played his highest minutes ever
- Finals #1 he started and played his usual minutes (less than 30), but got another short stint when the game went to extra time
- He missed finals #2 injured.

What all of this tells me is that as the season went on, Hunt played his way ahead of Tolman and Fifita - but not anyone else. He wasn't a regular in the team until 3 middle forwards all got injured, and the only time his minutes went up was when Rudolf was out injured. In those same games BHU still played more than him.

Fitz wants to play a certain way, which dictates that a genuine prop is on the field for the opening 20. There were times in 2022 when Royce Hunt was the best choice to play that opening 20, but on average he played less than 6-7 minutes/game after the 20-minute mark. When everyone is healthy, he may still end up being the guy who wears the #10, but a healthy BHU is playing more minutes than him every time.

And as that shows, to be fair to Hunt, he's only just emerged in our pack. BHU and Williams were ahead of him and did good enough jobs to keep him out. I think now Hunt has played himself into that echelon and he's on the rise.

I would prefer he starts over BHU at this stage. BHU seems to be getting a few injuries and looks better on reduced minutes, while Hunt seems to play with the same punch no matter how long he's on for (wondering if you have a chart to verify?)... He feels like a bigger Talakai!
 

bort

Jaws
Joined
Jun 4, 2007
Messages
29,908
Reaction score
5,821
Location
IN A BAR
And as that shows, to be fair to Hunt, he's only just emerged in our pack. BHU and Williams were ahead of him and did good enough jobs to keep him out. I think now Hunt has played himself into that echelon and he's on the rise.

I would prefer he starts over BHU at this stage. BHU seems to be getting a few injuries and looks better on reduced minutes, while Hunt seems to play with the same punch no matter how long he's on for (wondering if you have a chart to verify?)... He feels like a bigger Talakai!
Not sure that is fair to BHU, he was very good early last season when starting. Was post injury he struggled to re-find form. May very well be capable of getting back to playing his best regardless of whether it is starting or bench. I think the injury/interruption were more of a factor than the role change/minutes.
Started the season playing 35, 34, 40, 39, 44, 32 (probably would have played another 6 if not injured) and his season average ended up being 33 so was doing 'above average' time on field at start of year.

I do agree I think Royce's standing in the club has elevated now, and shouldn't start behind BHU or Williams for any kind of perceived senior or established role they may have over him. May the best man win.
Although I don't love the idea of Williams winning a starting prop jersey over those two...
 

Sparkles

Jaws
Joined
May 21, 2008
Messages
11,996
Reaction score
2,725
Not sure that is fair to BHU, he was very good early last season when starting. Was post injury he struggled to re-find form. May very well be capable of getting back to playing his best regardless of whether it is starting or bench. I think the injury/interruption were more of a factor than the role change/minutes.
Started the season playing 35, 34, 40, 39, 44, 32 (probably would have played another 6 if not injured) and his season average ended up being 33 so was doing 'above average' time on field at start of year.

I do agree I think Royce's standing in the club has elevated now, and shouldn't start behind BHU or Williams for any kind of perceived senior or established role they may have over him. May the best man win.
Although I don't love the idea of Williams winning a starting prop jersey over those two...
I think I basically said what you're saying. BHU was good enough to keep out Hunt. I think BHU is getting a bit injury prone these days and would suit lower mins, and Hunt is good enough to take the starting spot.

I feel like we all still have a bit of d*ck fingers Williams PTSD that will take a while longer to get past.
 

BurgoShark

Super Moderator
Joined
Apr 8, 2008
Messages
12,794
Reaction score
4,018
And as that shows, to be fair to Hunt, he's only just emerged in our pack. BHU and Williams were ahead of him and did good enough jobs to keep him out. I think now Hunt has played himself into that echelon and he's on the rise.

I would prefer he starts over BHU at this stage. BHU seems to be getting a few injuries and looks better on reduced minutes, while Hunt seems to play with the same punch no matter how long he's on for (wondering if you have a chart to verify?)... He feels like a bigger Talakai!
Yep. Output was great.

The pie charts are the big indicator here. Hunt plays most of his minutes in short stints. When starting he usually played the first 20-24 minutes, and then a short stint of 5-8 minutes later on.



index.php


index.php
 

BurgoShark

Super Moderator
Joined
Apr 8, 2008
Messages
12,794
Reaction score
4,018
I don't doubt the playing more than him comment. Just saying I think Hunt will start and BHU will play either side of half time.
So it's a rotation discussion then...

Is it worth having a guy to start, play the first 20, and not do much after that though? It seems that was by necessity in 2022 rather than by choice.

In a healthy squad you've got McInnes (60), Finucane (55) and Rudolf (50) taking up about 165/240 minutes for middles. Say BHU plays 35 to take it to an even 200, that leaves 2 spots for guys to share 40 minutes between them (or one middle and two part-time middles). Hunt is one of those. If you like the idea of having him play early minutes that's fine, but you are committing to having him sit for the majority of the game once he is off.

Best pack Finucane, McInnes, Rudolf, BHU + 2 others. Hunt is one of the others, whether you want him starting or off the bench.

Probably moot anyway. Someone will get injured or suspended and then whoever is left will play heaps anyway.
 

andrew's_sharks

Great White
Joined
Sep 10, 2010
Messages
4,204
Reaction score
602
Location
Melbourne
So it's a rotation discussion then...

Is it worth having a guy to start, play the first 20, and not do much after that though? It seems that was by necessity in 2022 rather than by choice.

In a healthy squad you've got McInnes (60), Finucane (55) and Rudolf (50) taking up about 165/240 minutes for middles. Say BHU plays 35 to take it to an even 200, that leaves 2 spots for guys to share 40 minutes between them (or one middle and two part-time middles). Hunt is one of those. If you like the idea of having him play early minutes that's fine, but you are committing to having him sit for the majority of the game once he is off.

Best pack Finucane, McInnes, Rudolf, BHU + 2 others. Hunt is one of the others, whether you want him starting or off the bench.

Probably moot anyway. Someone will get injured or suspended and then whoever is left will play heaps anyway.
This is what always happens.

I would probably play McInness at starting hooker and still play him for 60 minutes and that would free up an extra 20 minutes from Brailey coming on mid first half with the idea he runs more and give some of the big guys more game time (Hunt could take 10 of that as an example)
 

BurgoShark

Super Moderator
Joined
Apr 8, 2008
Messages
12,794
Reaction score
4,018
This is what always happens.

I would probably play McInness at starting hooker and still play him for 60 minutes and that would free up an extra 20 minutes from Brailey coming on mid first half with the idea he runs more and give some of the big guys more game time (Hunt could take 10 of that as an example)
I guess that's one way to approach it. I'm not a big fan of McInnes at hooker though, and I don't subscribe to the "Brailey doesn't run enough because he plays too much" idea. I think Brailey is running the exact amount that his coach wants him to.
 

Sparkles

Jaws
Joined
May 21, 2008
Messages
11,996
Reaction score
2,725
Yep. Output was great.

The pie charts are the big indicator here. Hunt plays most of his minutes in short stints. When starting he usually played the first 20-24 minutes, and then a short stint of 5-8 minutes later on.



index.php


index.php
Cheers mate. And not much of a drop off when his minute we doubled, possibly tripled. We don't need him to do bigger minutes right now but it's great that we have the option.
 

Jaz

Great White
Joined
Nov 18, 2009
Messages
3,926
Reaction score
594
Location
Jannali
In a healthy squad you've got McInnes (60), Finucane (55) and Rudolf (50) taking up about 165/240 minutes for middles.
Wouldn't mind giving 10 or so mins from Toby to someone else. He's a special for an error when tired.
 

Rob

Hammerhead
Joined
Aug 12, 2021
Messages
438
Reaction score
240
Fitz only real error last year was his use of the bench with 5 min Tricky and using Fifita the way he did forcing others to push longer than they should, would have screwed the stats a lot.
Some younger fresher legs this year should allow a lot better rotation and more flexibility in reacting to fatigue on the run.
 

bort

Jaws
Joined
Jun 4, 2007
Messages
29,908
Reaction score
5,821
Location
IN A BAR
I think I basically said what you're saying. BHU was good enough to keep out Hunt. I think BHU is getting a bit injury prone these days and would suit lower mins, and Hunt is good enough to take the starting spot.

I feel like we all still have a bit of d*ck fingers Williams PTSD that will take a while longer to get past.
I agree, I think there is a bit of combo of remembering the dicks and forgetting the good play because he never got a proper chance to back it up by missing so much of last season.

They all have a preseason to impress Fitz for spots and I certainly can't try and take a guess at whose house is more or less trained down than anyone else's. Hope they are all killing it and can go healthy through preseason and play vast majority of season too.

If someone (whether I rate them or not) misses out because Fitz picks someone else on game day then so be it, better than just being able to pick who is healthy.
 
Last edited:
  • Like
Reactions: Rob

Rob

Hammerhead
Joined
Aug 12, 2021
Messages
438
Reaction score
240
Dick fingers does worry me with playing Fitz ball with props passing so much.
 

andrew's_sharks

Great White
Joined
Sep 10, 2010
Messages
4,204
Reaction score
602
Location
Melbourne
I guess that's one way to approach it. I'm not a big fan of McInnes at hooker though, and I don't subscribe to the "Brailey doesn't run enough because he plays too much" idea. I think Brailey is running the exact amount that his coach wants him to.
I would just start him to take the initial contact in defence and as a way to rotate the forwards more and give guys like Jack Williams some game time.
 
Top