Official Sione Katoa

Gards said:
Sione was already playing with a niggle/injury in the game against the Roosters (picked up during the game or started with it) and my understanding is that it was aggravated or at best didn't improve in the following days
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Not being a smart arse but injury was manageable enough to play NSW Cup but not FG & he injured it further playing NSW Cup?
 
Bundy Shark said:
Not being a smart arse but injury was manageable enough to play NSW Cup but not FG & he injured it further playing NSW Cup?
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Evidently yes, but there is also a week of recovery and rehab between games. It's not like he played Cup the very next day. We don't know what his training regime and workload was during the week either.

SNP already explained the difference between managing an injury playing (and training for) Cup vs. FG where alot more is at stake and the intensity is higher.

Maybe he got the injury sorted or near 100% and coach was just playing it safe and gave him time back in Cup as a precaution. Not unheard of

Someone like Hynes or Brailey, yea maybe you skip that part and bring them back a week or 2 early if you have some really tough or key games coming up provided you have enough confidence their bodies are good to go

As part of this time in Cup Fitz might have wanted Sione to also work on a few things in his game as well - both could happen at once but when isn't there things to improve in a players game
 
Bundy Shark said:
Maybe not as brutal as telling player A is better than player B but essentially, player B is going better, deserves the opportunity etc.
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That makes even less sense given the circumstance we are talking about though - Sione told Stonestreet is going better and deserves the opportunity, to then have Stonestreet told Sione deserves the opportunity back, when he hasn't even been playing?
(not saying your specifically saying that the chances of them both being 'dropped' is probably low)

I agree though, who knows, and I'm not saying it can and should never happen, just showing why the word doesn't get used flippantly by clubs and people like Shinaz - the situations are often a bit more nuanced than how fans tend to use the term.

Bundy Shark said:
Recent high profile teams or teams in lofty ladder positions who have dropped players
Broncos - Mamm
Panthers / Tago
Storm - Lehiero
Roosters - Walker (I think last season? the season before, Crighton)
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This is not a lot of examples for something every team supposedly does more often than the sharks - I am sure you could dig up a few more if you wanted but I'm not saying people are never dropped, just it's not as common as people think.

Mam - looks pretty dropped to me
Just to the bench but with young Duffy starting, not even the veteran Hunt, and even Josh Rogers playing at lock, he is clearly either being sent a message or just genuinely has lost the jersey for time being.

Tago this season being semantic I'd say he was beaten for the spot by other players, he didn't start the season in the team and lose a jersey, he was benched from round 1. Similarities of course, but it (dropped) is just not the language I'd use for his particular situation, but nor would I say it was wildly incorrect.
In 2025 Alamoti got opportunities in round 26 and 27 due to restings which saw him go on to hold the position over Jenkins for finals. Jenkins arguably was dropped or 'lost the jersey', either way someone else took his shirt so dropped is probably close enough.

When was Trent Loiero dropped?
This season it appears he has been suspended, suspended, bench, lock, lock, lock, lock, lock, lock, lock, lock, SOO, lock, lock, bye
There was a rumour that maybe Bellamy or other storm players weren't happy with him and I think Howarth.
But I do not see where he was dropped, and Howarth also has either played each game, or missed through reported injury.

And yes, in 2023 a 20 year old Sam Walker seems to have been dropped back to reserve grade. At that age, I don't think anyone should be shocked he had stuff to work on.
Angus had mental health issues that saw his form dip dramatically and go on to start 2024 in Cup. I'd argue mental health (bipolar disorder) falls more into the injury category than he was just dropped. You may argue the alternate, but again, just like may happen with our players, someone may not think dropped is the most suitable term, rather than they are afraid to use it.
 
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Gards said:
Sione was already playing with a niggle/injury in the game against the Roosters (picked up during the game or started with it) and my understanding is that it was aggravated or at best didn't improve in the following days
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Yeah started with it. Was the Warriors game the week before he originally got the injury. Finished the game heavily strapped. Injury came beforehand, but if you see Katoa before and after the Talakai try you can see they have strapped his ankle in the break.


Bundy Shark said:
Not being a smart arse but injury was manageable enough to play NSW Cup but not FG & he injured it further playing NSW Cup?
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Gards gave you a good answer too - but here is mine from earlier when someone asked the exact same question.


Sharks NRL Prospects said:
In hindsight he should have just sat out starting that week and maybe he comes back a week or two earlier than he did - but I can understand the decision.

It's fairly common in other sports for players to drop to the minor/reserve league for a short time to manage an injury. Stakes are much higher at the top level and wins for the B team are nice but don't really matter.

Every other outside back being fit/available at the time was probably also a factor in letting him play. I reckon if they were down a few guys they make him sit it out.
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Bundy Shark said:
Not being a smart arse but injury was manageable enough to play NSW Cup but not FG & he injured it further playing NSW Cup?
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Yeah this one was weird. We don't know the ins and outs but... weird.
Our docs told him he would be limited but shouldn't be an elevated risk to make it worse and then he was either unlucky or they were wrong?

There's a piece of missing info here for me, because I though he was good the week before his bad game, and I think also the week before that if I recall correctly. Then he appeared to struggle due to an injury, and next game played Cup and got hurt worse.

Of course, entirely possible Fitz didn't think he played well the two prior weeks, or that week, and everyone considered the injury a non factor (until it then became one).
 
Agree with Bortman

Players don't get genuinely dropped that often (outside of discipline or off field issues), it usually takes a reasonably long string of poor performances

Coaches pick and back their selections because they have seen enough of these players and trust them enough to be a regular starter in FG - not because they are unsure or have suddenly yolo take a punt on some bloke from Cup and see what happens on the day

It's different with rookies perhaps that a coach is forced to select due injuries or suspensions (i.e they were only ever intended as a temp selection / fill in - bonus if they go great) but for established players it doesn't tend to happen quickly. It will bubble over time towards the coach having to pull that level and drop a first grader down.

Rudolf was dropped, not off the back of one lazy game but because his fitness and attitude had been waning for a while I would suggest. Rudolf even said words to this effect that he deserved it and needed to sort his **** out. That didn't come out of the blue to the coach, he had been seeing the signs and finally had enough giving any more chances for the player to turn it around.

Coaches value attitude, team mentality and work ethic immensely, often over raw talent and ability. Cam wouldn't have a place in this squad if it weren't for his willingness to give 100% week in week out, put his body on the line and tackle his heart out all game and set an example to the other players.

He ain't there for his incredible ability with the ball or his good looks

Hiroti hasn't been dropped for instance, he has played fairly well for us and become a reasonably good player but there just isn't room in the starting 17 anymore with the established centre pairing back on board. It's not from anything he has done wrong. The coach relises that Iro, Ramien, Hiroti and Talakai all have their pros and cons as the starting centre.

Hiroti just hasn't had as many opportunities as those guys to get the runs on the board and points in the bank to be first selected.

Coaches will never use the word dropped either, not publicly especially. It's always along the lines of player X needs some time to work on a few things or get a niggle right. If they are really pissed off at a player they might not be so diplomatic and just outright say the player needs an attitude adjustment and to earn his way back to the top grade.

Coach / player relationship plays a big part and the 2 ways communication between both parties

Sticky dropped Jarrod Crocker down at the back end of his career as he just wasn't providing as much value or performance for the team as he once was, getting older, slower, other players coming up through the grades ect. but Jarrod had also been struggling with injury. Which reason do you think Sticky have the media?

Sticky was very respectful about it as he valued the player and his contribution to the club and team and there was no point making things harder for the players and fans than it needed to be. Recall media and fans were calling for Crocker to come back early to get his milestone game

It took Flanno an age to drop Pomeroy, he didn't have alot of other viable choices in his early days coaching the Sharks but Pomeroy had been a meme his entire career so you can't say it wasn't coming but Flanno still gave him alot of time as he was technically the established centre for the Sharks since 2007
 
bort said:
I haven't checked the word count, but I reckon you got me, well played
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Your on the verge of being dropped for poor performance

Quickly go injure your mouse hand or something so the forum don't have to do you like that

Make it easy on yourself by making it easy on us
 
Gards said:
Your on the verge of being dropped for poor performance

Quickly go injure your mouse hand or something so the forum don't have to do you like that

Make it easy on yourself by making it easy on us
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You have no idea what some of us are playing through

IMG_5790.jpeg
 
Gards said:
Yea mate that's what I was getting at, coming back through reggies is a pretty normal part of managing a return from injury depending on the player and type of injury. The fact Sam got some additional FG experience during this time and himself was fit to play was a bonus
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That was the original name for NRL360
 
Gards said:
Unless someone like Sam had a direct quote from Fitz himself I question how much weight or accuracy it would carry anyway despite how connected they are to the club and "inside mail"

It's completely out of character for any FG coach to drop an established player after a couple bad plays in a single game UNLESS there are underlying attitude or fitness issues.

Sione has never come across as having an attitude or work ethic issue, like ever so I am banking on it being a niggle/injury related and not much more

Fans and media use the word "dropped" flippantly and interchangeable with being not selected in the starting 17 but it isn't really the same thing. A player being genuinely rested over injury concerns has not been dropped due to poor performance.

Kafusi and Talakai playing reduced minutes doesn't mean they are out of favour with Fitz or lost his trust, it could just be the coach managing workloads over a long season and reacting to games requirements tactically.



IIRC Sione was one of our best performers in the finals last year
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I hadn't said he wasn't good. My point was more that he doesn't have to be in first grade to continue improving, and there's enough to work on to make it worthwhile. You don't need to drop Katoa - he has enough over Stoney that we're a better chance of winning overall with him in the side. The gap is closing though... Sione wasn't at a consistently decent level until what, a couple of years ago?
 
At the end of the day, injury or no injury, he went from first grade to reserve grade which is being dropped. He could have easily sat a week out if they wanted to rest him, not still play footy at a high level.
Hes got his spot back now so good for him
 
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