Official Billy Magoulias

BurgoShark

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yea probs don't need this bloke aye...

I’ll have to look up his stats, I can barely remember him

cause he only made 1 run mate

seriously wtf

His passing on that left side shift was perfect. No other forward in the team can do what he can do with the ball. Unfortunately his work without the ball is what has been keeping him out of the NRL, and he didn’t do anything in his stint tonight to change that.

Ditto for Williams
 

egg

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His passing on that left side shift was perfect. No other forward in the team can do what he can do with the ball. Unfortunately his work without the ball is what has been keeping him out of the NRL, and he didn’t do anything in his stint tonight to change that.

Ditto for Williams

Hopefully a new bench against Raiders
 

CrazyMatt

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Yeah I’m done with this guy. Put Wilton or Fifita in there next week if we have to, he just isn’t up to it.
 

bort

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Yeah I’m done with this guy. Put Wilton or Fifita in there next week if we have to, he just isn’t up to it.

Yeah typically I don't see a huge need for Wilton on bench, but can't be any less valuable than Mags. Hopefully either him or Fifi played well enough in Cup to get the call up. Wilton scored a try.
 

BurgoShark

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this guy is ****ing ****e

get rid of him asap

Yeah I’m done with this guy. Put Wilton or Fifita in there next week if we have to, he just isn’t up to it.

Yeah typically I don't see a huge need for Wilton on bench, but can't be any less valuable than Mags. Hopefully either him or Fifi played well enough in Cup to get the call up. Wilton scored a try.

Guys - he was on for 11 minutes, 3 of which was used up by conversions after tries. It's quite clear that the plan was always for him to have a very short stint to rest the other middles.

Also - on watching the replay I actually mistook an earlier Williams miss for Billy, so I take back my comment about him not being good in defence yesterday.

I just re-watched his stint.

- Comes on to the field in the 46th minute
- First set he leads the kick chase but someone else makes the tackle, he gets to marker a few times during the set and makes a couple of good tackles
- Dragons score of a bomb, and about 90 seconds elapses between the try and the next kick off
- Next set he leads the chase from the kick off and makes 2 more good tackles
- 50th minute Brailey dives on a loose ball and the Sharks get the ball for the first time in Billy's stint. They run an exit set towards the left edge (i.e. away from where the lock is) and kick it
- Billy leads the kick chase and is involved in the tackle
- Brailey gives up a set restart on 3rd tackle
- Billy makes a good tackle on the next set
- Dragons then turn it over on the Sharks 10
- Billy takes a hit up on tackle 2
- Sharks get a set restart on tackle 3
- On the 3rd tackle Billy is involved in a shift to the left. Makes a crisp, clean pass to Townsend. Shift leads to a half break. Sharks then bomb to a corner and tackle the Dragons about 12m out
- Billy leads the kick chase but someone else makes the tackle. Billy makes 3 tackles in a row in this set
- Billy chases from marker, Dragons go back through the middle to find a lazy A defender in Williams and score on the 4th tackle. Another 90 seconds elapses between the try and the kick-off
- Billy leads the kick chase again from the kick off and makes the tackle. Dragons drop it on the second tackle.
- Billy comes from the field in the 56th minute

**

So for you blokes who would rather look at stats than actually watch the game...

Billy was on for 8 minutes of action. During this 8 minutes...
- Sharks had the ball for 11 tackles, four of which were used by having outside backs run from dummy half
- From the remaining 7 tackles when they had the ball, Billy took one hit up and was involved in a passing movement which led to a half break
- Dragons had the ball for 26 tackles. Billy made 10 of them, missed none, and 5/5 times led the kick chase

If you didn't notice him or think he was poor it is because he wasn't out there long and the Sharks didn't have the footy much when he was. His stint was as good as you could ever expect from a bench forward, and I'm sure his teammates and coach appreciate his involvement in defence.
 

stormshark

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Yeah i'l cut him some slack, how many players used to starting, also find it very hard to get into the game, from a short stint off the bench. Having said that, against the Raiders either He or William's has to go, if we got troops back.
 

CHOGM

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Guys - he was on for 11 minutes, 3 of which was used up by conversions after tries. It's quite clear that the plan was always for him to have a very short stint to rest the other middles.

Also - on watching the replay I actually mistook an earlier Williams miss for Billy, so I take back my comment about him not being good in defence yesterday.

I just re-watched his stint.

- Comes on to the field in the 46th minute
- First set he leads the kick chase but someone else makes the tackle, he gets to marker a few times during the set and makes a couple of good tackles
- Dragons score of a bomb, and about 90 seconds elapses between the try and the next kick off
- Next set he leads the chase from the kick off and makes 2 more good tackles
- 50th minute Brailey dives on a loose ball and the Sharks get the ball for the first time in Billy's stint. They run an exit set towards the left edge (i.e. away from where the lock is) and kick it
- Billy leads the kick chase and is involved in the tackle
- Brailey gives up a set restart on 3rd tackle
- Billy makes a good tackle on the next set
- Dragons then turn it over on the Sharks 10
- Billy takes a hit up on tackle 2
- Sharks get a set restart on tackle 3
- On the 3rd tackle Billy is involved in a shift to the left. Makes a crisp, clean pass to Townsend. Shift leads to a half break. Sharks then bomb to a corner and tackle the Dragons about 12m out
- Billy leads the kick chase but someone else makes the tackle. Billy makes 3 tackles in a row in this set
- Billy chases from marker, Dragons go back through the middle to find a lazy A defender in Williams and score on the 4th tackle. Another 90 seconds elapses between the try and the kick-off
- Billy leads the kick chase again from the kick off and makes the tackle. Dragons drop it on the second tackle.
- Billy comes from the field in the 56th minute

**

So for you blokes who would rather look at stats than actually watch the game...

Billy was on for 8 minutes of action. During this 8 minutes...
- Sharks had the ball for 11 tackles, four of which were used by having outside backs run from dummy half
- From the remaining 7 tackles when they had the ball, Billy took one hit up and was involved in a passing movement which led to a half break
- Dragons had the ball for 26 tackles. Billy made 10 of them, missed none, and 5/5 times led the kick chase

If you didn't notice him or think he was poor it is because he wasn't out there long and the Sharks didn't have the footy much when he was. His stint was as good as you could ever expect from a bench forward, and I'm sure his teammates and coach appreciate his involvement in defence.
His chase out of marker looked more like rushed pressure on what he thought was an early kick to me. It created a hole which is why they went that way. My impression has been that our defence in the middle suffers when he has played, but it may be that he ends up with other guys who aren’t familiar with each other. The Duffy try had tolman/Williams/Mags collectively to blame IMO.

The true test would be Mags in the middle with Woods and Uele for a solid stint.
 

bort

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Good well backed up counter argument.
Good to see that on close inspection the fresh legs took on a good workload in D and kick chase. Stats read 10 made 1 miss which is still solid, depending on quality of miss. Not sure what it refers to that you didn't see, unless something in kick chase?

Ball out of play explains why I barely remember seeing him - he didn't have a huge amount of active minutes by the sound of things.

Still there is nothing there that jumps out at me as making him irreplaceable. Perhaps that was about as good as could be asked of him given the opportunity but if he is only worth such a short stint his value is still in question.

You've convinced me to hold off overly questioning his selection for next week, especially as I haven't seen what Teig and Fifita contributed in Cup to make a case for them to come up.

Given Bombers comments saying these guys impressed him too much to not pick them that kick chase effort could be a huge factor towards his future opportunities.
 

BurgoShark

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His chase out of marker looked more like rushed pressure on what he thought was an early kick to me. It created a hole which is why they went that way. My impression has been that our defence in the middle suffers when he has played, but it may be that he ends up with other guys who aren’t familiar with each other. The Duffy try had tolman/Williams/Mags collectively to blame IMO.

The true test would be Mags in the middle with Woods and Uele for a solid stint.

It didn't create a hole. It forced them back in the ruck where Williams should have been defending. Magoulias did his job. Tolman did his. Brailey (The A defender on the other side) moved up. Williams was standing still.

I am doing a similar review of Williams minutes right now. He started walking in defence 2 sets prior to that. Dragons targeted him.

I agree that the team has suffered in previous games from poor defence from Billy.


Good well backed up counter argument.
Good to see that on close inspection the fresh legs took on a good workload in D and kick chase. Stats read 10 made 1 miss which is still solid, depending on quality of miss. Not sure what it refers to that you didn't see, unless something in kick chase?

Ball out of play explains why I barely remember seeing him - he didn't have a huge amount of active minutes by the sound of things.

Still there is nothing there that jumps out at me as making him irreplaceable. Perhaps that was about as good as could be asked of him given the opportunity but if he is only worth such a short stint his value is still in question.

You've convinced me to hold off overly questioning his selection for next week, especially as I haven't seen what Teig and Fifita contributed in Cup to make a case for them to come up.

Given Bombers comments saying these guys impressed him too much to not pick them that kick chase effort could be a huge factor towards his future opportunities.

Definitely didn't miss one. As you said - could be kick chase related. Sometimes when a guy holds his line and lets the fullback go across field to get tackled they count that.

I'm not arguing that he's irreplaceable, but he certainly was not a liability (like Williams was). I also have always liked the idea of playing with a middle who can pass the ball. Not just short passes. I mean a bloke good enough to be part of a sideline to sideline shift. There are very few players like that in the NRL (Jurbo, Yeo are the best. Radley is decent but his passing is only good one way). If Billy can pick up his defence he can be a huge asset in attack.
 
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Good well backed up counter argument.
Good to see that on close inspection the fresh legs took on a good workload in D and kick chase. Stats read 10 made 1 miss which is still solid, depending on quality of miss. Not sure what it refers to that you didn't see, unless something in kick chase?

Ball out of play explains why I barely remember seeing him - he didn't have a huge amount of active minutes by the sound of things.

Still there is nothing there that jumps out at me as making him irreplaceable. Perhaps that was about as good as could be asked of him given the opportunity but if he is only worth such a short stint his value is still in question.

You've convinced me to hold off overly questioning his selection for next week, especially as I haven't seen what Teig and Fifita contributed in Cup to make a case for them to come up.

Given Bombers comments saying these guys impressed him too much to not pick them that kick chase effort could be a huge factor towards his future opportunities.

I think if it was a Talakai or Hunt in that jersey they would have played alot more minutes imo. I think some of our middles were maybe on a little too long, so a bench forward to play more than that would help.
 

bort

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Definitely didn't miss one. As you said - could be kick chase related. Sometimes when a guy holds his line and lets the fullback go across field to get tackled they count that.

That's exactly the scenario I was suspecting given what you had written.

I think if it was a Talakai or Hunt in that jersey they would have played alot more minutes imo. I think some of our middles were maybe on a little too long, so a bench forward to play more than that would help.

I agree Talakai and Hunt would have gotten more minutes and would have likely been quite noticeable for good contribution. The fact Billy didn't warrant the same opportunity is as much my knock on him as anything.

If Billy can carve out a niche for himself in the side for only 10-20 minutes of high work rate but it is Williams and all his minutes that become available to these guys then I don't really have an issue with that, especially if it because Billy was taking Tracey's minutes.
 

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I think part of the issue is that he doesn't fit the middle forward stereotype. Most fans want their middles to be straight up and down guys who get through plenty of work but also get noticed by making big runs and eye-popping tackles. Billy isn't going to be that sort of forward; he's more like an 80's/90's lock or back rower than one from the last 20 years. I think there is plenty of scope for that type of player to carve out a role in the NRL.
 

CHOGM

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I think part of the issue is that he doesn't fit the middle forward stereotype. Most fans want their middles to be straight up and down guys who get through plenty of work but also get noticed by making big runs and eye-popping tackles. Billy isn't going to be that sort of forward; he's more like an 80's/90's lock or back rower than one from the last 20 years. I think there is plenty of scope for that type of player to carve out a role in the NRL.
Nick Graham style? You should be Billy’s public relations guy-I’m retracting my criticism.
 

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Looking back through the sharks in the 80’s and 90’s, I’d say the 11,12,13 were often our best players. So many good ones. Halves and hookers? Not so much.
 

bort

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I think part of the issue is that he doesn't fit the middle forward stereotype. Most fans want their middles to be straight up and down guys who get through plenty of work but also get noticed by making big runs and eye-popping tackles. Billy isn't going to be that sort of forward; he's more like an 80's/90's lock or back rower than one from the last 20 years. I think there is plenty of scope for that type of player to carve out a role in the NRL.

I have no objects to the style, just needs to be good enough to warrant selection - if he is only being given 10 mins while Williams falls apart on field then there is a question mark over whether he is. Could be a spot for him over Tracey if his most likely contribution is 10ish high workrate minutes with some ball playing.
 

BurgoShark

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Nick Graham style? You should be Billy’s public relations guy-I’m retracting my criticism.

Nick Graham would be a good example of what I meant.

Looking back through the sharks in the 80’s and 90’s, I’d say the 11,12,13 were often our best players. So many good ones. Halves and hookers? Not so much.

Agreed.

I have no objects to the style, just needs to be good enough to warrant selection - if he is only being given 10 mins while Williams falls apart on field then there is a question mark over whether he is. Could be a spot for him over Tracey if his most likely contribution is 10ish high workrate minutes with some ball playing.

Yeah I agree. I wasn’t necessarily responding to you. I just meant “in general” that’s probably where a lot of the criticism comes from.

I think we can all agree that post-Covid 2020 Billy did himself no favours and didn’t warrant selection. Round 2 last season though he was outstanding. I’d like to see more of that guy.

I also don’t rate Tracey as a 9 at all. His passing and defence are both way worse than Billy’s. Injury cover, Yes. Hooker - nope.
 

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Billy is lazy when it comes to offense. He had 3 runs over the weekend for 35 meters, playing 42 minutes. In a game where a lot of our team were tired from playing long minutes he never stepped up. To put it in perspective, Wade had 3 runs in 18 minutes of play.
 
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